Unfortunately, this throws the baby out with the bathwater - you also lose all the useful non-AI widgets, like calculator, unit conversions, instant weather, maps, etc.
There are other tools for that, but I confess that I've gotten used to defaulting to the address bar for random queries like that - the browser is always open.
shortformblog 292 days ago [-]
Creator here. All you have to do to get those things back is just hit the “all” tab on your results, or if you use a search with "&udm=14" added, just keep the original Google around as a second search. I personally use “g” for full-fat Google and “gw” for Web only.
This obviously doesn’t solve every problem with Google, and it cuts in some ways. Obviously, if you are searching for, say, when a restaurant is open, you are going to want to use the knowledge panels. The goal of this is to make up for those situations where you need a simplified view, but Google has intentionally made it hard to reach that view.
violet13 292 days ago [-]
My point is that when you have it configured the usual way, you can type "2 + 2 =" in the address bar and get the result. Which, you know, is sort of convenient. Or "weather mountain view ca", or whatever.
If you change your default search to udm=14, you lose that. Sure, you can click around on the now-useless results page to get back to standard Google and get the answer, but that's friction that wasn't there before. The parameter doesn't just kill the AI stuff.
shortformblog 292 days ago [-]
I mean, I absolutely understand your point. I guess I would push back and say that the friction of not having easily accessible web results is much larger, and given that this was the original intended purpose of Google, it feels like there should be a method where that takes precedence.
Going back to the “All” page is a single click on a button that never moves. The “Web” mode is two clicks, minimum, each time, and the link is often never in the same place, making it difficult to get muscle memory. You are basically deciding between two levels of frustration, and for many users, the latter wins. In your case, it sounds like the former does.
I absolutely do not think in your case, you should make udm14 your home page. There may be a UX solution that could be put in place here, so the original search is still accessible from the site if you want it. But for people whose goal is to find information from websites, this is a change that may absolutely be welcomed by them.
Let’s not let it be lost here that the real problem is that Google arguably ruined its knowledge panels by treating the AI results like one.
effdee 294 days ago [-]
This pairs quite well with &tbs=li:1 ("Verbatim" search).
jimbobthrowawy 292 days ago [-]
If you're in a region that google defaults to another language, &hl=en (or another language code) is very useful. Nowadays I mainly use it for the maps site, but I've used it elsewhere before when I couldn't struggle through a website in another language. It's very hard to get it into certain google products, like recaptcha. So I have to learn the words for what it wants clicked.
I don't know if parsing the Accept-Language header is too slow, or if google's trying to encourage people to log in to an account.
ekimekim 292 days ago [-]
From what I've heard, Google purposely ignores the Accept-Language header because they believe browsers with a mis-configured language (eg. the browser is set to use english when the user doesn't want english) is more common than browsers with a correctly configured language that differs from their geoip location (eg. someone in France who wants to view a site in english).
jimbobthrowawy 292 days ago [-]
That was my guess too. I haven't checked if they ignore it for all languages, or just English.
I remember being very confused when another site (wttr.in) would show up in Russian on a friend's computer for some reason. I later learned that clicking "never translate <language>" back then in chrome's prompt to translate would add that language to the Accept-Language header. The site then served this version, despite en-ie and en being higher priority.
mdaniel 294 days ago [-]
Are these params documented, or just reverse engineered from the JS or something? TFA didn't cite its source, either
eichin 292 days ago [-]
On a plain search, click on more, click on web, and then look at the URL you end up on, it's right there. (So, in the most limited sense of the word, "reverse engineered" but in a way that is less work than finding documentation would be if there were any :-)
xcdzvyn 294 days ago [-]
[dead]
akasakahakada 293 days ago [-]
But verbatim is not useful these days imo. Usually I rather accept that there doesn't exist such information than waste time in googling stuff.
metadat 292 days ago [-]
It still works, sometimes. Usually in the afternoon.
At least on mobile, this one has way too much text cramped on that screen with too many distracting colors (I understand that the colors are from Google’s logo). Some of the text is promotional links (not necessarily harmful to the user).
A simple “old style Google” search page, with a clear title that it’s AI free Google search and just one link to explain what &udm=14 is, would look a lot nicer. As it stands now, most people wouldn’t know or understand what this is because they’d skip long walls of small text.
The link to the page explaining how to add this as a default and every other promotional link can go into that page.
shortformblog 292 days ago [-]
I will keep tweaking the UX. The thing is, people are raising complaints in real time (Why isn’t this working for me? Is this safe?) and I am trying to quickly address them. It is very much a repairing-a-car-already-in-motion situation.
banish-m4 294 days ago [-]
AI is simultaneously overhyped in application but under-appreciated in terms of long-term implications.
The problem I was attempting to solve here was one of convenience, really. I think Google is intentionally trying to make its AI search look better by burying more traditional results in a way that is not easy to find. Given how widely used Google is, I just do not think it’s fair to end users that there’s a lightweight option that gives people 90% of what they want from Google results, and they’re hiding it for what appear to be business reasons. I guess in a way, it’s a simple protest dressed up as an easy-to-use tool.
I trust that most HN users are likely smart enough to figure out how to work around the Google issue without this site, but I think the solution is ultimately for the people who can’t or won’t make those changes themselves, or just want an easy starting point.
My other goal with this was an attempt to make the code “famous,” by making it something that people knew about. On that count, it appears successful, as the &udm=14 fix has been covered broadly in media and has been frequently shared on social media.
This link has gone pretty viral in the last four days, well beyond the tech sphere, and at current count has seen more than 100,000 visitors since Wednesday. Not bad for a site that is literally a few Tailwind classes and a simple HTML page built by hand.
f_devd 294 days ago [-]
Doesn't fix ranking unfortunately
b0ner_t0ner 292 days ago [-]
You will still have to manually dig for gold in this SEO Wasteland.
torgeros 294 days ago [-]
Fyi, google just announced a new "Web" search option (in the ...More menu next to Images, News and so on). This skips all the AI stuff, too.
hutattedonmyarm 294 days ago [-]
This is exactly that. All this site does is direct to the "Web" search option in Google. Hence the name "&udm=14", because that is the query parameter causing Google to display the web search option
294 days ago [-]
rldjbpin 291 days ago [-]
for all the costs associated with running the new features, i wonder why there is not a search preferences option to toggle AI responses?
it seems that even people engaging in shady activities tend to google search while logged in (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40456722), it seems like a simple and ergonomic solution for most people, which would also work across devices.
Pesthuf 293 days ago [-]
I hope we get extensions that auto-append this soon.
wwillyw 292 days ago [-]
You can sort of fake it with Chrome settings by setting up a site search that's just like the default Google one but with whatever you want tacked on. Add a site search called Google2 or whatever, use shortcut 'g' and for the URL add '{google:baseURL}search?q=%s&{google:RLZ}{google:originalQueryForSuggestion}{google:assistedQueryStats}{google:searchFieldtrialParameter}{google:language}{google:prefetchSource}{google:searchClient}{google:sourceId}{google:contextualSearchVersion}ie={inputEncoding}&udm=14'
Then just type 'g' + <space> + 'your search parms' in the address bar, you don't even need to navigate to Google.com first
shostack 292 days ago [-]
Is there anything that can get this to replace the results from the default Android search bar?
konspence 294 days ago [-]
I have a personal distaste for the multi-syllable word in the headline. I acknowledge that may be a 'me' thing, though I do have reasons which are off-topic.
But seeing it prominently displayed on the homepage of this site is offputting, regardless of my feelings about the word in general.
dang 292 days ago [-]
We've replaced it with the subtitle now.
amatecha 294 days ago [-]
That's how I feel about "performant". Unfortunately I'll never stop seeing such jargon every day or two, working in tech. It is what it is, I guess. :\
dgellow 294 days ago [-]
What’s the problem with performant?
amatecha 291 days ago [-]
It means "of or pertaining to performance". Like "the performant qualities of this software are currently being evaluated", or the one example of its original meaning I could find from Cambridge Dictionary, "What follows is a series of re-mappings of both the performant and the referent functions that emphasizes the collective performance." The word itself doesn't indicate efficient/good performance, nor poor/slow/etc. ... It just refers to the quality or property of performance. For some reason, very recently it started being used to mean "performs well" or "performs optimally" and has transformed into jargon.
euroderf 294 days ago [-]
You have to ask ?
dgellow 294 days ago [-]
I’m asking, yes
antifa 292 days ago [-]
Either they are annoyed that everything claims to be fast, or they prefer slow bloated software.
There are other tools for that, but I confess that I've gotten used to defaulting to the address bar for random queries like that - the browser is always open.
This obviously doesn’t solve every problem with Google, and it cuts in some ways. Obviously, if you are searching for, say, when a restaurant is open, you are going to want to use the knowledge panels. The goal of this is to make up for those situations where you need a simplified view, but Google has intentionally made it hard to reach that view.
If you change your default search to udm=14, you lose that. Sure, you can click around on the now-useless results page to get back to standard Google and get the answer, but that's friction that wasn't there before. The parameter doesn't just kill the AI stuff.
Going back to the “All” page is a single click on a button that never moves. The “Web” mode is two clicks, minimum, each time, and the link is often never in the same place, making it difficult to get muscle memory. You are basically deciding between two levels of frustration, and for many users, the latter wins. In your case, it sounds like the former does.
I absolutely do not think in your case, you should make udm14 your home page. There may be a UX solution that could be put in place here, so the original search is still accessible from the site if you want it. But for people whose goal is to find information from websites, this is a change that may absolutely be welcomed by them.
Let’s not let it be lost here that the real problem is that Google arguably ruined its knowledge panels by treating the AI results like one.
I don't know if parsing the Accept-Language header is too slow, or if google's trying to encourage people to log in to an account.
I remember being very confused when another site (wttr.in) would show up in Russian on a friend's computer for some reason. I later learned that clicking "never translate <language>" back then in chrome's prompt to translate would add that language to the Accept-Language header. The site then served this version, despite en-ie and en being higher priority.
A simple “old style Google” search page, with a clear title that it’s AI free Google search and just one link to explain what &udm=14 is, would look a lot nicer. As it stands now, most people wouldn’t know or understand what this is because they’d skip long walls of small text.
The link to the page explaining how to add this as a default and every other promotional link can go into that page.
The problem I was attempting to solve here was one of convenience, really. I think Google is intentionally trying to make its AI search look better by burying more traditional results in a way that is not easy to find. Given how widely used Google is, I just do not think it’s fair to end users that there’s a lightweight option that gives people 90% of what they want from Google results, and they’re hiding it for what appear to be business reasons. I guess in a way, it’s a simple protest dressed up as an easy-to-use tool.
I trust that most HN users are likely smart enough to figure out how to work around the Google issue without this site, but I think the solution is ultimately for the people who can’t or won’t make those changes themselves, or just want an easy starting point.
My other goal with this was an attempt to make the code “famous,” by making it something that people knew about. On that count, it appears successful, as the &udm=14 fix has been covered broadly in media and has been frequently shared on social media.
This link has gone pretty viral in the last four days, well beyond the tech sphere, and at current count has seen more than 100,000 visitors since Wednesday. Not bad for a site that is literally a few Tailwind classes and a simple HTML page built by hand.
it seems that even people engaging in shady activities tend to google search while logged in (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40456722), it seems like a simple and ergonomic solution for most people, which would also work across devices.
Then just type 'g' + <space> + 'your search parms' in the address bar, you don't even need to navigate to Google.com first
But seeing it prominently displayed on the homepage of this site is offputting, regardless of my feelings about the word in general.